Q&A
Clarification on facial recognition website and discussion of protocol breaches
1:38:06
·
114 sec
Council Member Cabán challenges the NYPD's claims about their facial recognition website and questions whether there have been breaches of protocol in surveillance technology use. Deputy Commissioner Gerber acknowledges that while they take policies seriously, there have been instances where department policies were not followed perfectly.
- Cabán points out that the facial recognition website referenced by NYPD is outdated
- Gerber clarifies his earlier statement about breaches, distinguishing between IT breaches and policy breaches
- The exchange becomes tense as Cabán pushes for a yes or no answer about protocol breaches
Tiffany Cabán
1:38:06
Thank you.
1:38:06
Before I start my questions, I I just wanna clarify the record and provide some context for the record.
1:38:12
The facial recognition website that you referenced in your testimony and celebrated, it's it's old and it's outdated.
1:38:19
Those stats haven't been updated since 2019, and the patrol guide section posted on it is from 2020 even though the most recent version is from 2022.
1:38:27
It also doesn't list any information about false positives and false negatives.
1:38:32
So I just want that to be known.
1:38:35
And then you said in your testimony there's never been a breach of protocol in the use of surveillance technology.
1:38:41
Correct?
Michael Gerber
1:38:41
Just That's not what I said.
1:38:42
Council member, that's that is not what I said.
1:38:45
I was I was asked about whether there was a breach, an IT breach in connection with surveillance technology.
Tiffany Cabán
1:38:52
So has there been a breach of protocol in surveillance technology?
1:38:55
That's my question
Michael Gerber
1:38:55
to you.
1:38:56
If the question is, has anyone ever failed to follow any department policy into connection with any surveillance technologies?
1:39:04
Yes.
1:39:04
I'm sure that has happened at some point.
Gale Brewer
1:39:06
Thank you.
Michael Gerber
1:39:07
Wait.
1:39:07
Wait.
1:39:08
On.
1:39:08
Council member.
1:39:08
Member.
1:39:08
Council member.
1:39:09
Five minutes.
1:39:09
No.
1:39:10
But see.
1:39:10
No.
1:39:11
No.
1:39:11
It's not it's not a yes or no question.
1:39:13
It's not.
1:39:13
It's It's It's it's actually really not.
1:39:16
We I I would like to be able
Tiffany Cabán
1:39:19
Thanks for my time.
Michael Gerber
1:39:20
Would like to be able to respond to the council member and to provide a full answer.
1:39:23
That's all.
Jennifer Gutiérrez
1:39:24
We've only got five minutes though for limited Thank you.
1:39:27
For every member.
1:39:28
You're you and you all have a hard stop.
1:39:29
Correct?
Michael Gerber
1:39:30
I will stay here longer so I can answer the council member's question.
1:39:33
I would like to be able to answer her question, please.
Tiffany Cabán
1:39:36
It's a yes or
Michael Gerber
1:39:37
no question.
1:39:38
It's not a yes or no question.
Tiffany Cabán
1:39:39
Has there
Michael Gerber
1:39:40
ever been a breach of formal surveillance Council member, there are 50,000 members of the NYPD.
Tiffany Cabán
1:39:46
The answer is yes.
Michael Gerber
1:39:47
And the question and point is the point is the point is that we have policies in place.
1:39:52
We take this incredibly seriously.
1:39:54
If we learn of such breaches, people face discipline.
Tiffany Cabán
1:39:57
Thank
Michael Gerber
1:39:57
you.
1:39:57
But if the question is are we perfect?
1:39:58
The answer is no.
1:39:59
We are not perfect.
Tiffany Cabán
1:40:00
Great.